Westminster / Manchester / London Bridge / Parsons Green attacks

[Kevin Mcleod]

You can come and water my spaghetti tree if you get lots of spare time mate.

[James1979]

Not just that - the Tories' poll lead had been decimated with the dementia tax debacle and was plummeting. Wider issue is the Seth Rich DNC story the MSM is desperately trying to bury right now.

Wow, so now our government is blowing up children because polls have got closer? Or is it that the Tories will still win the election and you don't like it? There's only one group responsible for the bombing. I think it's pathetic, disgusting and just plain odd that people would even think that we would bomb our young at a pop concert to try to divert attention.

[James1979]

They're not 'pie in the sky theories' Kev, they're public domain facts. And you certainly haven't just watched two hour + long documentaries in the last 10 minutes! Do me a favour and actually watch them mate. Not point in continuing this debate otherwise. Unless you don't want to actually find out what they reveal of course. In which case, no point in continuing this debate either.

Public domain facts? Oh for the lover of satans ########, they are in the public domain but that doesn't make them facts.

[Tarbie]

Not just that - the Tories' poll lead had been decimated with the dementia tax debacle and was plummeting. Wider issue is the Seth Rich DNC story the MSM is desperately trying to bury right now.

Hubs, are you genuinely suggesting that the UK Government carried out these attacks to a.) cause a situation that could win them favour in the build up to the elections, or b.) because they are in cahoots with US and are trying to take column inches away from the fall out of an assassination (and I think it might have been by the way) of a journo in the US?

I know this Conservative government we have right now have proved themselves to be pretty callous, but that is way too far fetched for me.

I think what is more likely is that if this is an organised, ISIS attack. That in fact ISIS may have an agenda to keep the right in power in the West. Every single piece of Islamic terrorism since 911 has been done with the intention of stirring up a reaction from the West. Osama Bin Laden knew when he flew those planes into the towers that George Bush would retaliate with a war on the Arabic world. He knew exactly what he was doing. The last thing that ISIS want is a pacifist like Corbyn getting into power. Their whole agenda is completely reliant on governments and people in the West reacting to these attacks.

[Itsonlyagame]

Also, in regard to the 7/7 bombings here, there is strong evidence that it was a false flag, the most damning and shocking being this: A private company called 'Visor Consultants' carried out a live terror attack rehearsal on the morning of the 7/7 bombing at precisely the same stations where the bombs were detonated soon after. The MD of Visor Consultants, Peter Power was interviewed at the time about this:

"Peter Power on Radio 5 Live's Drivetime:

The first of Mr Power's interviews was given on the afternoon of 7th July 2005, presumably after Mr Power had finished orchestrating his private terror rehearsal, when he appeared on BBC Radio 5 Live's Drivetime programme. Below is a transcript from the Radio 5 Live programme, complete with a link to a recording of the interview:

POWER: ...at half-past nine this morning we were actually running an exercise for, er, over, a company of over a thousand people in London based on simultaneous bombs going off precisely at the railway stations where it happened this morning, so I still have the hairs on the back of my neck standing upright!

PETER ALLEN: To get this quite straight, you were running an exercise to see how you would cope with this and it happened while you were running the exercise?

POWER: Precisely, and it was, er, about half-past nine this morning, we planned this for a company and for obvious reasons I don't want to reveal their name but they're listening and they'll know it. And we had a room full of crisis managers for the first time they'd met and so within five minutes we made a pretty rapid decision, 'this is the real one' and so we went through the correct drills of activating crisis management procedures to jump from 'slow time' to 'quick time' thinking and so on.


Note how Power refers to 'simultaneous bombs going off'. Note also that it wasn't until 9th July 2005, two days after the incidents, that it was revealed the explosions on the underground were 'almost simultaneous'. Power's fictional scenario, as explained by the man himself on the day, bears a closer resemblance to the eventual story of 7/7 than it does to the actual story that had been presented to the public by the police and authorities at the time of his interview.

Only ex-Mossad Chief, Efraim Halevi who wrote in the Jerusalem Post on 7th July 2005 of "the multiple, simultaneous explosions that took place today on the London transportation system" with "near pefect execution" was able to demonstrate the same level of 'insight' as Mr Power. Note: The original article is no longer available on the Jerusalem Post web site although copies can be found on the web."

Link to interview: http://www.julyseventh.co.uk/media/r...r.exercise.mp3

From: http://www.julyseventh.co.uk/july-7-...tml#interviews

Hubs, unless I'm missing something the bloke says they were running an exercise based on simultaneous bombs going off.
He does not say that simultaneous bombs went off.
Even if he did, that would mean squat. It would have been a fair assumption based on the reports the police would have received that morning, even if it didn't filter through to the press until later.
Proxy wars in other countries yes but to suggest the British government or security services are colluding with suicide bombers to murder its own citizens and now children, here in the U.K.
Give over please.

[Hubble]

Hubs, unless I'm missing something the bloke says they were running an exercise based on simultaneous bombs going off.
He does not say that simultaneous bombs went off.
Even if he did, that would mean squat. It would have been a fair assumption based on the reports the police would have received that morning, even if it didn't filter through to the press until later.
Proxy wars in other countries yes but to suggest the British government or security services are colluding with suicide bombers to murder its own citizens and now children, here in the U.K.
Give over please.

No, the point is they simulated simultaneous bombs, in exactly the same locations as they later went off. The chance of that being a coincidence is astronomically small.

As for the other points people have raised, I am afraid to say government agencies do and have bombed their own people. It is a horrendous, nightmare scenario that understandably most people reject as impossible, but I'm afraid it's all too true. I think many of you are completely underestimating just how ruthless the powers that be really are. Beyond comprehension really. As for the point about public domain and facts, well here both boxes are ticked. Instead of saying I'm talking nonsense or whatever, why don't you actually watch the documentaries in question? Do you think Stan and I make this stuff up or we're so deluded and gullible that we're ready to believe pie in the sky nonsense? Maybe you do. But I can assure you that, like many of you, I was deeply sceptical and suspicious when all this was first suggested to me. Then I began to research and investigate and I began, reluctantly, to change my mind. No one likes to discover than the agencies that are supposed to protect you can also be your enemies.

Do I think the government did this on purpose? No, not directly. They may well be completely innocent or unaware. They may be complicit. Often these atrocious acts are carried out by agencies who form what is known as the 'deep state'. I don't like being a person who says these things because I only get flak and ridicule for it, but once you've discovered it, what are you supposed to do? Just ignore it? I suppose I could do that. But my feeling is that if more people are aware of the machinations of the deep state, the more chance this will stop.


As for states colluding with bombers to murder their own people I'm afraid it's very real. Operation Gladio shows this clearly. It's a very, very nasty world out there in the world of geopolitics, ruthless, and driven by the self-justifications of control and power that ultimately people may or may not think are valid justifications.

[Itsonlyagame]

No Hubs, I'm not suggesting Stan or yourself are making this all up.
You've just chosen to believe a different point of view and you have every right to.
Either that or you've both been planted on this forum to gather momentum for the anti establishment group you're affiliated to in preparation for a coup I think I'll leave that one to the conspiracy theorists though !
Seriously though, I don't completely disagree with your "deep state" but you obviously feel it's much larger in this country than I do.
Many other countries do murder their own citizens and some are quite open about it.
In this country my gut feeling is there is more to what goes on behind the scenes than meets the eye.
However, as unpalatable as it might come across, the actions of our secret service are for the greater good.
That certainly doesn't include orchestrating mass murder on our shores.
There will always be a few renegades within any organisation and that includes government etc, I think we just disagree on how many there are and how much power they have.
I have to admit I don't read up too much on the alternative views you mention, I won't call them conspiracy theories cause I know you hate that reference !
My problem is, there's often never any hard evidence either way and what we read will always be slanted, one way or the other.
Take for instance your link earlier. You seemed to suggest the bloke talking knew the bombings were simultaneous, even before it was reported. My point was, he seems to me to be referring to their drill, not the actual events that took place.
As I said, even if he had referred to the bombings directly as simultaneous, would that not have been a fair assumption on his part based on his position and the real time info he would have been getting that morning. The coincidental nature of their drill and what happened, I can't explain that. But not being able to explain something doesn't always mean there's a sinister conspiracy involved.
What you and I believe is really down to interpretation, unless there are hard facts involved.
A bit like religion unfortunately.

[James1979]

the bombs on 7/7 went off between stations and one went off on a bus because the northern line was too busy. All these conspiracy theories are pathetic. I watched the one on 911, and after watching that I will not be wasting time watching any more of this rubbish. Hubble, you're sprouting this rubbish because you don't want a Tory government.... especially clear by other posts you made. It's at best odd that you would do that.

[Hubble]

Very well put Itso and I agree with you. I don't want to get all religious about this, I'm just conveying what Iv'e discovered over 15 years of research.

I agree that everything is open to interpretation, as is what happened before the 7/7 attacks, and of course they may have coincidentally prepared for simultaneous attacks. But like I said before, the chances of them carrying out the drill in exactly the same places as the attacks took place, out of the entire tube and rail network of London, are astronomically small. That is what raises the suspicions. Then of course there are all sorts of other details about those bombings that make the official story very iffy, but I won't go into that now for fear of boring people.

My brother has been in the army for over 30 years, started out as a squaddie, now he's a high up. So I get a lot of insight from him as to how things work. I agree that often state agencies do a great deal of good, they do what they're supposed to do. I think by and large the police do a very good job on ever diminishing resources. I think it's terrible how much Theresa May cut their budgets as Home Secretary, she has really ####ed our police force, and THAT is dangerous, never mind the rest. We should be increasing their budgets, not decimating them.

However, it cannot be ignored or denied that state agencies also do some very bad things. They lie and present fake evidence when it suits them - the Iraq invasion is a prime example. We all know that's not a conspiracy theory, it's a proven fact. And if you research this stuff, you discover just how bad some of the things they get up to are. I don't believe these elements of state agencies are working for the general public or the general good, I think they're working for the vested interests of a minority, and these are the people who you might call the 'puppet masters' since they pull the strings. And at that level, it's got nothing to do with nation states or sovereignty, it's all about control, money and power. They often act with impunity, irregardless of the human cost. All of it is in the mix, the good, the bad and the ugly, and I don't think we should close our eyes to that.

Bottom line is people get hurt, and that is tragic.

[Hubble]

the bombs on 7/7 went off between stations and one went off on a bus because the northern line was too busy. All these conspiracy theories are pathetic. I watched the one on 911, and after watching that I will not be wasting time watching any more of this rubbish. Hubble, you're sprouting this rubbish because you don't want a Tory government.... especially clear by other posts you made. It's at best odd that you would do that.

Yes, you're right, I don't want a Tory government, but that has got nothing to do with what I'm talking about or my motivation. I've been following this for years. It's not rubbish. But feel free to believe what you want. I'm not going to stop you or try to persuade you otherwise. The 7/7 rehearsal took place at the nearest stations to where the bombs were detonated. Call that a coincidence if you want. They took place just hours before the real bombs went off too. Again, feel free to call that a coincidence.

From the wikipedia entry on the 7/7 bombings:

"On the day of the bombings Peter Power of Visor Consultants gave interviews on BBC Radio 5 Live and ITV saying that he was working on a crisis management simulation drill, in the City of London, "based on simultaneous bombs going off precisely at the railway stations where it happened this morning", when he heard that an attack was going on in real life. He described this as a coincidence. He also gave an interview to the Manchester Evening News where he spoke of "an exercise involving mock broadcasts when it happened for real".[40] After a few days he dismissed it as a "spooky coincidence" on Canadian TV.[41]"

[James1979]

But if we increase budgets to our armed forces and police force, won't Theresa be able to commit more atrocities in other UK cities?

[James1979]

Yes, you're right, I don't want a Tory government, but that has got nothing to do with what I'm talking about or my motivation. I've been following this for years. It's not rubbish. But feel free to believe what you want. I'm not going to stop you or try to persuade you otherwise. The 7/7 rehearsal took place at the nearest stations to where the bombs were detonated. Call that a coincidence if you want. They took place just hours before the real bombs went off too. Again, feel free to call that a coincidence.

You said that it was due to opinion poll decline?? Sounds like you are doing just that. Odd.

[Hubble]

But if we increase budgets to our armed forces and police force, won't Theresa be able to commit more atrocities in other UK cities?

No, and now you're being facetious. The police do not and have never, to my knowledge, committed atrocities like this. This is of a completely different order.

[Hubble]

You said that it was due to opinion poll decline?? Sounds like you are doing just that. Odd.

I implied it was a possible factor. The thing is, state agencies often act without the approval or even knowledge of the government at the time. They have their own agendas. Surely you know that?

[Hubble]

I'll tell you something though, I agree that many of these people should not even be in this country. And it was a Blair immigration policy that opened the floodgates. I also agree we have been far too soft in dealing with radical Islamism. I do not believe we should have Islamic faith schools in this country, preaching a religious view of the world that is entirely at odds with modern, rational thinking. We, the ordinary people of this country have been betrayed by successive governments whose interests, it seems to me, are serving themselves and their paymasters, not the general public.