Europe. In or out?

[CroydonCaptainJack]

If the majority on here wanted Brexit it shows they were generally of a negative disposition in the first place. Now they are getting what they wanted I suppose. All very sad and divisive.

This is the kind of sweeping genralisation that I find particularly annoying.
There are people who voted Brexit because they could not see any benefit that this doomed project has bought us. It takes months/years to achieve anything significant with all those Counrties trying to agree with each other. Countries have been shoe-horned into it despite not meeting the 'strict' criteria and what it is really all about is Political Union.

Funnily enough we are not all little Englander bigots despite what the non-Brexiteers want to portray.

[wortonranger]

How is wanting to better yourself as a country negative? Some would say the 'Remainers' were negative, 'we'll put up with the cr.ap because that's all we know', and are still throwing their toys out. The two biggest doom merchants ever in recent memory must be Cameron and Osborne, they would go down well on here as posters.

Just from my own experience. I was out campaigning for Remain with my local MP ( a conservative by the way ). The majority of those who wanted out were rather angry and irrational in conversation. They had an axe to well and truly grind. For many it was a protest vote and you don't usually protest when you're happy - compare this board when we win or lose ! Trust me, I am trying tipi find the positives in the outcome, but finding it very hard. !( just like when we lose a game we should have won). For a lot of us, the Post Brexit world seems a very sad place.

[wortonranger]

I said " generally" . Of course by no means all. See my later post.

[Olly]

Brexit and QPR share the same denominator for progress up the world order - patience.

[CroydonCaptainJack]

Just from my own experience. I was out campaigning for Remain with my local MP ( a conservative by the way ). The majority of those who wanted out were rather angry and irrational in conversation. They had an axe to well and truly grind. For many it was a protest vote and you don't usually protest when you're happy - compare this board when we win or lose ! Trust me, I am trying tipi find the positives in the outcome, but finding it very hard. !( just like when we lose a game we should have won). For a lot of us, the Post Brexit world seems a very sad place.

ok, fair enough.
It is early days yet though regarding tour last point.

[Olly]

That's one of the reasons they lost, the haves had no idea of what the have-nots were going through. Some of us knew that and bet accordingly.

[Bluehoop]

Brexit and QPR share the same denominator for progress up the world order - patience.

Spot on Olly

[dogsrrs]

This is the kind of sweeping genralisation that I find particularly annoying.
There are people who voted Brexit because they could not see any benefit that this doomed project has bought us. It takes months/years to achieve anything significant with all those Counrties trying to agree with each other. Countries have been shoe-horned into it despite not meeting the 'strict' criteria and what it is really all about is Political Union.

Funnily enough we are not all little Englander bigots despite what the non-Brexiteers want to portray.

Spot on ! Now the reminders want it turned over saying yeah look at the pound slipping when everybody knew it would initially to deter the the Dutch Germans and many French from considering own exit , let them come back in 5 years and say it was wrong

[CroydonCaptainJack]

Spot on ! Now the reminders want it turned over saying yeah look at the pound slipping when everybody knew it would initially to deter the the Dutch Germans and many French from considering own exit , let them come back in 5 years and say it was wrong

[jmelanie]

Shows what sort of organization it is when a small section of Belgium (Wallonia) can scupper a deal with Canada which has taken 7 years to agree.

The devaluation of the pound is a good thing for the U.K. because it means that if tariffs are imposed it won't make much difference to U.K. companies because it is already cheaper for them to export their goods. However EU imports will be more expensive.

Also inflation might not be a problem. Unilever tried to rise prices (with Tesco and other supermarkets) in the U.K. The supermarkets in the U.K. refused so they ended up raising prices for a supermarket chain in Southern Ireland (who are in the Euro zone).

[Awin]

Shows what sort of organization it is when a small section of Belgium (Wallonia) can scupper a deal with Canada which has taken 7 years to agree.

The devaluation of the pound is a good thing for the U.K. because it means that if tariffs are imposed it won't make much difference to U.K. companies because it is already cheaper for them to export their goods. However EU imports will be more expensive.

Also inflation might not be a problem. Unilever tried to rise prices (with Tesco and other supermarkets) in the U.K. The supermarkets in the U.K. refused so they ended up raising prices for a supermarket chain in Southern Ireland (who are in the Euro zone).

Finally agreed - EU-Canada trade deal: Belgians break Ceta deadlock
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37788882

I can understand assurances sought by farmers. In the end assurances were given and deal agreed. I certainly don't see it as an advert for leaving the EU.

[dogsrrs]

Shows what sort of organization it is when a small section of Belgium (Wallonia) can scupper a deal with Canada which has taken 7 years to agree.

The devaluation of the pound is a good thing for the U.K. because it means that if tariffs are imposed it won't make much difference to U.K. companies because it is already cheaper for them to export their goods. However EU imports will be more expensive.

Also inflation might not be a problem. Unilever tried to rise prices (with Tesco and other supermarkets) in the U.K. The supermarkets in the U.K. refused so they ended up raising prices for a supermarket chain in Southern Ireland (who are in the Euro zone).

Did they really ?? Shows their answer if someone stands up to them they have hit someone even if it's one of their own

[jmelanie]

Finally agreed - EU-Canada trade deal: Belgians break Ceta deadlock
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37788882

I can understand assurances sought by farmers. In the end assurances were given and deal agreed. I certainly don't see it as an advert for leaving the EU.

Thanks but perhaps this article is more significant

Nissan to build new models in Sunderland
Read more at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37787890

[Hubble]

Shows what sort of organization it is when a small section of Belgium (Wallonia) can scupper a deal with Canada which has taken 7 years to agree.

The devaluation of the pound is a good thing for the U.K. because it means that if tariffs are imposed it won't make much difference to U.K. companies because it is already cheaper for them to export their goods. However EU imports will be more expensive.

Also inflation might not be a problem. Unilever tried to rise prices (with Tesco and other supermarkets) in the U.K. The supermarkets in the U.K. refused so they ended up raising prices for a supermarket chain in Southern Ireland (who are in the Euro zone).

I beg to differ about your first point - on the contrary, what the Wallonian veto showed is that the EU does still have a semblance of democracy. Furthermore, the trade deal with Canada they opposed - CETA - is as flawed as TTIP, because like TTIP, it gives corporations unprecedented powers over our lives, including the right to sue governments if they feel a particular government's policy is detrimental to their business. In other words, it is the antithesis of democracy. I was therefore very pleased to see the Walloon veto. However, your point is now moot anyway, since Paul Magnette, the president of Wallonia has dropped his opposition to CETA after some desperate horse trading by the EU. So ironically this actually proves your initial point, but in the opposite way to how you saw it. The fix is in. As I understand it, this is also bad for the UK, because as we are still members of the EU, we will be beholden to this deal. My only hope is that as it still needs to be ratified, it might stall at a later stage.

In terms of devaluation - you can argue it both ways - good and bad - there are upsides and downsides to devaluation. for example, my brother's business has suffered greatly from devaluation since he has to buy from Europe. As his is one of thousands of companies in a similar position, I find your statement that it won't make much difference to UK companies rather glib. Also petrol prices have risen significantly. However, as Dogs says, currency volatility was inevitable following the Brexit vote and we cannot say how things will be in 5 years time.

Inflation is definitely a problem if you're trying to save money, because of course the value of any savings you might have diminishes. And of course for people (hitting those on low wages particularly), the cost of living rises.

Whether Brexit is a success or not depends on many variables, and in today's unpredictable world, we just can't say how it will pan out. How this government handles it is key. So far, they are not giving me much confidence. We've just seen Theresa May's leaked remarks to Goldman Sachs prior to the referendum, where she raises the many economic problems that could arise from Brexit - in complete contrast to what she's saying now. However, by the same token, we've also just seen Nissan make a major reinvestment in its car plants in Sunderland and also a 0.5% growth in the UK economy. For me, independence is the best thing about Brexit, but as I said, it all depends how it's handled. Sometimes interdependence is better than independence.

[Shepherds Mush]

Brexit Shmexit.....zzzzzzz