Mark Hughes or holloway.

[Tarbie]

And to me thats got nothing to do with tony whatsoever tarbs, thats to do with the coaching structure and how there doing things on the training ground, also about the players that have been signed etc, cant see what that has to do with tony mate tbh!

I don't understand how it can't be to do with Tony Pinks.

For every major decision that has been made since Fernandes has come in, the buck stops with him. Every bit of expenditure, he has signed off. Every managerial appointment, he has ultimately decided. He has also decided when to remove each of our managers.

You can point at the infrastructure around the club and say that wasn't good enough. But as I've pointed out of previous threads, perhaps in that case TF should have invested money in that when he arrived rather than spending it on salaries for Boswinga, Cesar, Park etc.

[Shania]

He signed 15 players, which could have filled nearly every position on the park.

Amongst them were Boswinga, for which he shall never, ever be forgiven for.

Though he did sign BOBBY!!! Which i will begrudgingly give him credit for.

I strongly suspect that many of the players he signed were recommeded to him by Fernandes and of course Kia..

[Tarbie]

You must have missed those bucket collection days.. you might have missed the position we were in before that magic adel season.

We had one good season on the up and up (totally unexpected btw) and since then we have reverted to type. TF had made poor decisions on a grander scale but essentially it's same old QPR.

I was there throughout all of those days mate. The point is, promotion should have been our ticket out of that. But rather than do the sensible thing, live within our means and use the extra revenue to making lasting improvements to the club, we went of this silly spending spree and ran up huge bills for players that really didn't give a sh*t, and we are still paying for it now.

[Cjskinz]

I was there throughout all of those days mate. The point is, promotion should have been our ticket out of that. But rather than do the sensible thing, live within our means and use the extra revenue to making lasting improvements to the club, we went of this silly spending spree and ran up huge bills for players that really didn't give a sh*t, and we are still paying for it now.

which was Hughes' and Redknapps' fault... unless you place the blame at Fernandes feet for backing experienced managers!

[Shania]

And to me thats got nothing to do with tony whatsoever tarbs, thats to do with the coaching structure and how there doing things on the training ground, also about the players that have been signed etc, cant see what that has to do with tony mate tbh!

Oh dear..Rose tinted glasses and all that.

[Shania]

which was Hughes' and Redknapps' fault... unless you place the blame at Fernandes feet for backing experienced managers!

He wanted us sign high profile players who where clearly over the top!!!!!

[Tarbie]

which was Hughes' and Redknapps' fault... unless you place the blame at Fernandes feet for backing experienced managers!

First mistake Tony made was appointing Phil Beard and putting him in charge of the commercial side of the club. Phil Beard didn't know the first thing about running a football club. Yeah, he'd been in and around sports, but he didn't know anything about contracts, agents etc. hence we are still paying agents fees from that era now.

The second mistake he made was giving Mark Hughes carte blanche to sign who he wanted, when he wanted. As Shania pointed out, I think TF basically encouraged Hughes to sign these expensive players.

To be honest, anyone who understands football, with half a brain in their head would have assessed the club, the infrastructure, the training facilities etc. and worked out what needed to be invested there, then worked out what funds were left to bolster the squad. Just think what we could have done with 250m invested wisely, rather than pi$$ed up the wall on expensive contracts for players that should never have been at a club like ours in the first place?

Don't get how so many of our fans are so quick to shift the blame away from TF to be honest. It's so obvious to me where our shortcomings are!

[topperharley]

The 4 failed after him because 3 have being paying for Hughes' (and Redknapps) mistakes!

Certainly were.

Though they were all short sighted appointments. JFH included considering what they gave him to work with, still some money signings there to mix with El Kacko and friends? Nah.

I don't mean this in any other context than this. Charlie was one of our worst signings, his goals glossed over problems from Hughes that Harry added to.

If only the lad could stay fit. Deffo one of the best strikers this country has produced since Linekar or Shearer, could be first name on the England sheet. Stick Harry Kane in that failing QPR side and watch him score 20 goals in a season? Doubt it.

But hey, nearly all of the dead wood from that era has gone now and we can put that to bed, hopefully like this pointless debate.

[Pinkie]

I don't understand how it can't be to do with Tony Pinks.

For every major decision that has been made since Fernandes has come in, the buck stops with him. Every bit of expenditure, he has signed off. Every managerial appointment, he has ultimately decided. He has also decided when to remove each of our managers.

You can point at the infrastructure around the club and say that wasn't good enough. But as I've pointed out of previous threads, perhaps in that case TF should have invested money in that when he arrived rather than spending it on salaries for Boswinga, Cesar, Park etc.

I agree with your last bit about investing it, but you cant say you wasnt chuffed with those managers he got at the time, they just didnt work out but maybe we was punching above our weight, but we/you would of been moaning if he had of chose managers that were lesser big names, basically youre just blaming him for managers failing which is wrong, as no one knows who would be a success and who wouldnt, usually seems majority arent these days & like pointed out before we`ve only had a few great seasons with rest being average and what we`re seeing now in my opinions the bottom of it!

[Pinkie]

[/B]


Oh dear..Rose tinted glasses and all that.

Whys it rose tinted? you cant blame a man for trying to bring the best in the club he could & then getting let down by them, obviously hes learnt his lessons on that front, but has gone from one extreme to another with spending which isnt great, hence why we`ve struggled in my opinion!

[Tarbie]

I agree with your last bit about investing it, but you cant say you wasnt chuffed with those managers he got at the time, they just didnt work out but maybe we was punching above our weight, but we/you would of been moaning if he had of chose managers that were lesser big names, basically youre just blaming him for managers failing which is wrong, as no one knows who would be a success and who wouldnt, usually seems majority arent these days & like pointed out before we`ve only had a few great seasons with rest being average and what we`re seeing now in my opinions the bottom of it!

To be honest Pinks, I was happy with each of the managerial appointments with the exception of Chris Ramsey and Ollie.

I disagree that "they just didn't work out" though. The fact that good managers continue to fail, time and time again is indicative of there being bigger problems in the background. i.e. Poor infrastructure, lack of direction, poor leadership from Director level etc.

[Pinkie]

To be honest Pinks, I was happy with each of the managerial appointments with the exception of Chris Ramsey and Ollie.

I disagree that "they just didn't work out" though. The fact that good managers continue to fail, time and time again is indicative of there being bigger problems in the background. i.e. Poor infrastructure, lack of direction, poor leadership from Director level etc.

Have already said and agreed about the infrastructure being the main problem apart from going out and wasting money on big names when they shouldnt of come here as they didnt give a sheeite! but after all this its hard to build things back up again especially with a low budget!

[Awin]

To be honest Pinks, I was happy with each of the managerial appointments with the exception of Chris Ramsey and Ollie.

I disagree that "they just didn't work out" though. The fact that good managers continue to fail, time and time again is indicative of there being bigger problems in the background. i.e. Poor infrastructure, lack of direction, poor leadership from Director level etc.

As I've said previously we all know something is wrong but I'll be damned if someone can point the finger at exactly what.

TF (faults and all) appointed top experienced managers and backed them in the hope that you could miss a middle step and put together a top half premiership team.

Players signed were experienced premiership pros and long standing internationals.

MH has gone on to cement stokes place in exactly the position TF aspired towards.

I know Uncle Tony is his own worst enemy (like trump on twitter) but many if his worst decisions have on the surface and at the time seemed prudent.. it's just the ongoing QPR curse (players dieing young, Chinese national team bust up, guns in the boardroom, managers head butting players etc etc etc)

[Cjskinz]

First mistake Tony made was appointing Phil Beard and putting him in charge of the commercial side of the club. Phil Beard didn't know the first thing about running a football club. Yeah, he'd been in and around sports, but he didn't know anything about contracts, agents etc. hence we are still paying agents fees from that era now.

The second mistake he made was giving Mark Hughes carte blanche to sign who he wanted, when he wanted. As Shania pointed out, I think TF basically encouraged Hughes to sign these expensive players.

To be honest, anyone who understands football, with half a brain in their head would have assessed the club, the infrastructure, the training facilities etc. and worked out what needed to be invested there, then worked out what funds were left to bolster the squad. Just think what we could have done with 250m invested wisely, rather than pi$$ed up the wall on expensive contracts for players that should never have been at a club like ours in the first place?

Don't get how so many of our fans are so quick to shift the blame away from TF to be honest. It's so obvious to me where our shortcomings are!

The agents fees etc are a direct consequence of Mark Hughes paying big money for big names.

Fernandes encouraged Hughes to spend money on expensive players who Hughes' thought could keep us in the Premier League?? Of course he did!!! That's backing your managers! Shania's point was that Fernandes was telling Hughes who to sign which is ridiculous. Hughes would not stand for being told who to sign we know that.

Fernandes clearly had his trousers pulled down by the managers. Even Redknapp said Tony had his trousers pulled down by the previous manager and then proceeded to do it himself!

Do any of us really understand football other than what goes on on the pitch? I don't think so

[corbray]

I agree with your last bit about investing it, but you cant say you wasnt chuffed with those managers he got at the time, they just didnt work out but maybe we was punching above our weight, but we/you would of been moaning if he had of chose managers that were lesser big names, basically youre just blaming him for managers failing which is wrong, as no one knows who would be a success and who wouldnt, usually seems majority arent these days & like pointed out before we`ve only had a few great seasons with rest being average and what we`re seeing now in my opinions the bottom of it!

This. Its hindsight at its finest, at the time we all loved the managers and players being brought into the club and wanted more ... it didnt work out and screwed us over a bit but we the fans can hardly act like we knew our current situation would be the outcome. I can remember this forum when we were signing the big name players and near enough every player being signed was met with huge appreciation towards tony