QPR accounts for 2012/13 season

[QPR Richard]

exactly. these people either weren't around during the chris wright/flavio briatore/gianni paladini eras or have forgotten. tony fernandes (along with bhatia/mittal and his malaysian pals) is the best thing to happen to this club for a long time. im confident that he will learn from his mistakes and take us in the right direction. all the people attacking him seem to think they could do a better job, i would absolutely love to see them try, and then laugh my t!ts off when they fail.

Excellent post there.

[klonk]

The debt is mostly in-house, so I am not really concerned.

What I would like to see is FIFA/UEFA Premier League etc, introduce rules that state quite catergorically that if owners.shareholders loan clubs money in order to fulfil their plans, then that is at their own risk and thy cannot claim the money back if they decide to leave. It should be treated as any business risk i.e. if I decided to set up a shop selling woolly hats and scarfs in Dubai, it is at my own risk if it fails.

i don't think the debt is the main issue here. there's basically three ways that the shareholder debt thing plays out:

1 - in the long-term the cub becomes very successful and the current owners recoup their money (either through repayment or by writing the debt off as part of a lucrative sale to new owners);
2 - the club is only moderately successful and the owners lose patience and sell up, but because no one in their right mind would take ownership of the cub when it's in such debt, the owners write-off all/most of the debt to get rid; or
3 - then owners give up and call in their debt, liquidate the club and its assets (in plain english, sell the players and loftus road).

option 3 is not good, but i can't see it happening. i think the owners are committed, if only because they see the non-footballing financial advantages of what a new stadium could bring.

what worries me more is what happens if we don't get promoted. i think a legal challenge against the fines under ffp might be successful, but i'd expect the transfer embargo to be difficult to successfully challenge... if we don't go up, we'll have a transfer embargo from december 2014 for a long time until we're only losing £5-6m a year (i would guess that would be at least 4 windows, probably many more), we'll be very reliant on players (including underperformers) agreeing new contracts at lower wages and unproven youth players. there's going to be a long, long period of struggle for us - our main saving grace is that other teams will very probably be in the same boat.

[West London is Rss]

[QUOTE=James1979;1227196]

so your argument for why TF won't leave us in the shyte is that he has some other businesses, is an accountant, and has a good PR

...seriously?

The main point about this though isn't whether or not TF will actually ditch us - I don't think he will, the "muti-purpose sports arena" for which our club is a vehicle is too great a prize.

The issue is that we're now at a stage where we are completely at the mercy of a few rich people.[/QUOTE]

Really? Say they want to call in their "debt". What happens? We/QPR can't pay it, we go into admin, they lose the money. They're lending us money, we as a club do not have the ability to pay back. I can think of a lot better (and smarter) ways of making money out of QPR.

its debt they physically made themselves out of their own pocket.. They wouldn't do that, it would RUIN their reputation.
You wouldn't make an investment, leave and then try to reclaim back what you know, you have no chance of getting.

Tony's a good man, there is no way he would ever do that

[Ginger Ninja]

Shame 70% of rangers fans are not understanding this and going on a full attack at Tony which could have MASSIVE consequences.

exactly. these people either weren't around during the chris wright/flavio briatore/gianni paladini eras or have forgotten. tony fernandes (along with bhatia/mittal and his malaysian pals) is the best thing to happen to this club for a long time. im confident that he will learn from his mistakes and take us in the right direction. all the people attacking him seem to think they could do a better job, i would absolutely love to see them try, and then laugh my t!ts off when they fail.

[James1979]

[QUOTE=Geng;1227082]so your argument for why TF won't leave us in the shyte is that he has some other businesses, is an accountant, and has a good PR

...seriously?

The main point about this though isn't whether or not TF will actually ditch us - I don't think he will, the "muti-purpose sports arena" for which our club is a vehicle is too great a prize.

The issue is that we're now at a stage where we are completely at the mercy of a few rich people.[/QUOTE]

Really? Say they want to call in their "debt". What happens? We/QPR can't pay it, we go into admin, they lose the money. They're lending us money, we as a club do not have the ability to pay back. I can think of a lot better (and smarter) ways of making money out of QPR.

[West London is Rss]

Top post, agree 100%

Shame 70% of rangers fans are not understanding this and going on a full attack at Tony which could have MASSIVE consequences.

[Ginger Ninja]

sorry.. why are we not run properly now?.. mistakes were made. we get over it and learn from them... I wouldn't want anyone else in charge other than TF.
You want him out? Then that's your prerogative.

We have NO debt to anyone... we have a £15 mill loan that's it.. The debt we have acquired was made by the shareholders and is to the shareholders.
As an investment, they took that risk.

Top post, agree 100%

[West London is Rss]

some properly gullible people here.

gullible in what way Geng?

[Geng]

some properly gullible people here.

[West London is Rss]

I just don't get why everyone is absolutely sh1tting themselves without knowing anything about it.

A statement has been made which says it all.. I am not worrying. I will trust our chairman - the multi millionaire businessman who runs one of Asia's biggest airlines.
Oh his an accountant to.. for the last time!!

[stanistheman]

sorry.. why are we not run properly now?.. mistakes were made. we get over it and learn from them... I wouldn't want anyone else in charge other than TF.
You want him out? Then that's your prerogative.

We have NO debt to anyone... we have a £15 mill loan that's it.. The debt we have acquired was made by the shareholders and is to the shareholders.

As an investment, they took that risk.

I was typing something similar whilst you were sending this in

[stanistheman]

I'm sure this has been mentioned before but:
the only true debt seems to be the £15m and this is backed by the 21m stadium
Everything else is capital injected by companies owned by the shareholders - therefore in effect shareholder funds
Yes they can call the money back at anytime from the accounts but is this likely? They own the company
The £8m gate receipts is pathetic and you can see why we need a new stadium. We either move or become league 1 club
The shareholders (eg Tony) will have injected capital as they have for tax reasons I imagine.
In short the net debt is actually £11.4m (15 less the cash)

The debt is mostly in-house, so I am not really concerned.

What I would like to see is FIFA/UEFA Premier League etc, introduce rules that state quite catergorically that if owners.shareholders loan clubs money in order to fulfil their plans, then that is at their own risk and thy cannot claim the money back if they decide to leave. It should be treated as any business risk i.e. if I decided to set up a shop selling woolly hats and scarfs in Dubai, it is at my own risk if it fails.

[West London is Rss]

The only time we were run properly was the promotion season when Amit was heavily involved

sorry.. why are we not run properly now?.. mistakes were made. we get over it and learn from them... I wouldn't want anyone else in charge other than TF.
You want him out? Then that's your prerogative.

We have NO debt to anyone... we have a £15 mill loan that's it.. The debt we have acquired was made by the shareholders and is to the shareholders.
As an investment, they took that risk.

[Rangersw12]

would it really? because i've seen nothing from the mittals in the last few years to suggest they are that interested.

The only time we were run properly was the promotion season when Amit was heavily involved

[stanistheman]

Every club is now.. Some of the older boys might not like it but as Nick said. Its the way football has gone. like it or not

Unfortunately, that is all too true.

I am not worried about the debt itself, but more concerned about these FFP rules & potential fines and embargos.

The good news about this is that hopefully 20+ players on big Premiership wages will be off the books by July and QPR can go back to signing players willing to play for between £8-15K pw with a handful of exceptions.
The club can go on to building a proper wage structure so that if they ever get back to the Premiership they can try and stick to it.
The problem originally arose because Tango & Cash did not do any deals to build a Premiership squad when QPR won promotion and then Warnock & Fernandes panicked into signing highly paid players like Barton, Ferdinand & SWP and then Hughes made it even worse with a long list of overpriced and overpaid wasters.