QPR Finances

[acricketer]

WTF is going on?

Business.

[hal9thou]

j (loans) have been converted once again to shares according to some papers lodged at company house today.... the shares have a cash value of £21.9m, so i guess this is probably the value of the loans converted.

Ruben?

That 26% is horrific. Flagged it before and still sounds horrible. How can anyone agree to do business like that? WTF is going on?

[klonk]

just a quick note... noticed that something (loans) have been converted once again to shares according to some papers lodged at company house today.... the shares have a cash value of £21.9m, so i guess this is probably the value of the loans converted.

there's very little detail on the form (just the words 'loan conversion'), but £21.9m is close to (but not exactly the same) as the total of the £16m loan (that incurs an outrageous 26% interest charge) and the £5.9m interest charged in the 2016-17 accounts. it could be that... or it could be something else....

[hal9thou]

.
Check out the full details: https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/stat...78018494992385

Yup, good spot, I've linked to the Swiss Rambler blog before, he's done at least two excellent in depth pieces covering different financial periods. The twitter link is his latest summary.

Meanwhile I still can't find out who exactly we are appealing to re FPP. There was talk of CAS involvement (www.tas-cas.org) but that seems not to be the case.

[Artful]

Sounds positive

Lots of people talking about our finances, if you want an in-depth look at everything head over to @SwissRamble on twitter, very detailed. The highlights for us are our EBITDA rating, which basically is our earnings before interest, depreciation and amortisation is added. It in very basic terms represents our sustainability. And how we are running as a club. We are top in the Championship for that at the moment, and if you look at the graph detailing our rating for the last 8 years, we have massively turned a corner.
Check out the full details: https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/stat...78018494992385
No automatic alt text available.

[Kevin Mcleod]

Think tonight might of changed real madrids mind about smithies.

[hal9thou]

:thumb:

I'd still like to know exactly who we're appealing to re FPP. The Court for Arbitration in sport is sanctioned by UEFA to rule on FFP but to my knowledge that aint where we're headed.

I believe we're no longer questioning the legality of the sanction - we did that first time round - but the way the fine has been constituted. I think it's really strange that none of the clubs hit by FFP in the UK ever joined forces when taking action against FFP sanctions.

[Stanley]

Ha, I was going to suggest Oslos 10-20m post and Tarbs well reasoned response were bunged here...

Done. Have copied them here, so they're still in the source thread too.

[hal9thou]

Padam, can I suggest you also post this in the "I think we have to sell players for £10m to £20m" thread? As it really would be pertinent to that discussion.

Ha, I was going to suggest Oslos 10-20m post and Tarbs well reasoned response were bunged here...


Meanwhile, THIS is a pretty thorough examination of the current state of play, its a link to the webpage Hits was quoting from (post 21 above) but easier to read.

[Tarbie]

With youngsters breaking in and doing well, maybe Ned deserves credit for helping to create an environment in which they can thrive. If an offer comes in for one of our midfielder's then I am happy if we sell as it creates an opportunity for a youngster coming through. By all accounts we have three talented goalkeepers which doesn't make sense, and at least one should be sold.

Lumley, Ingram & Smithies?

Yeah, all 3 are good, but Smithies is head and shoulders above the other 2. We also don't have anyone that I'm aware of in the U23's who is close to first team football. If 1 of our keepers left, we'd have to find a replacement.

[Southport]

With youngsters breaking in and doing well, maybe Ned deserves credit for helping to create an environment in which they can thrive. If an offer comes in for one of our midfielder's then I am happy if we sell as it creates an opportunity for a youngster coming through. By all accounts we have three talented goalkeepers which doesn't make sense, and at least one should be sold.

[qpr4life]

1. Nobody knows what FFP really means to us as club once we finally get passed this initial fine.
2. Nobody knows what the plan is for the club going into the Summer and beyond, if you do you certainly have inside info.

[CroydonCaptainJack]

Let's be honest mate, none of us on here know if we do or don't have to sell players. It's all pure speculation. The OP has obviously looked at the annual accounts and has made some well thought out assumptions. But let's not ignore the fact that they are assumptions. For starters, we as fans are only privy to financial information that is a year old. Secondly, we have no idea what discussions are going on between the club and the FA with regards to FFP.

I will add that I'm glad it's this way. If detailed and recent financial information was public, and we were under pressure to reduce overheads to satisfy FFP, then the vultures would be circling around our best players.

I personally suspect that there may be a departure or 2 required, firstly to trim the wage bill and secondly for a cash injection to allow us to redress some of the imbalances in the squad (lack of centre forwards etc.). I doubt it will be Smyth or Eze that will go (although if someone came in with stupid money, I suspect both would have their price). But I could see someone like Smithies, Freeman or Luongo going. I also think we'll be trying hard to shift some of the more expensive fringe players like Sylla, Cousins etc.

My biggest concern this summer is the fact that Perch, Ned and Robinson are all out of contract. Of course losing Robinson will be a blow. But let's face it, going into the last year of his contract all of us on here thought he was a write off, he'd barely kicked a ball. Obviously from there he's found some terrific form this season, it's just unfortunate that it's happened in the final year of a 4 year contract. Ned has been a great servant, and we are a far better side when he plays, but he is also hugely overpaid and has been since the day we signed him. Perch I'd let go anyway, always injured and his form has swayed from awesome to downright awful over the course of his contract. Each of these departures in isolation wouldn't be a train smash, but I worry about 3 first team defenders leaving at the same time with very little in the coffers to replace them with.

Great post mate.

[Tarbie]

Let's be honest mate, none of us on here know if we do or don't have to sell players. It's all pure speculation. The OP has obviously looked at the annual accounts and has made some well thought out assumptions. But let's not ignore the fact that they are assumptions. For starters, we as fans are only privy to financial information that is a year old. Secondly, we have no idea what discussions are going on between the club and the FA with regards to FFP.

I will add that I'm glad it's this way. If detailed and recent financial information was public, and we were under pressure to reduce overheads to satisfy FFP, then the vultures would be circling around our best players.

I personally suspect that there may be a departure or 2 required, firstly to trim the wage bill and secondly for a cash injection to allow us to redress some of the imbalances in the squad (lack of centre forwards etc.). I doubt it will be Smyth or Eze that will go (although if someone came in with stupid money, I suspect both would have their price). But I could see someone like Smithies, Freeman or Luongo going. I also think we'll be trying hard to shift some of the more expensive fringe players like Sylla, Cousins etc.

My biggest concern this summer is the fact that Perch, Ned and Robinson are all out of contract. Of course losing Robinson will be a blow. But let's face it, going into the last year of his contract all of us on here thought he was a write off, he'd barely kicked a ball. Obviously from there he's found some terrific form this season, it's just unfortunate that it's happened in the final year of a 4 year contract. Ned has been a great servant, and we are a far better side when he plays, but he is also hugely overpaid and has been since the day we signed him. Perch I'd let go anyway, always injured and his form has swayed from awesome to downright awful over the course of his contract. Each of these departures in isolation wouldn't be a train smash, but I worry about 3 first team defenders leaving at the same time with very little in the coffers to replace them with.

[Tarbie]

Could not disagree more. We don't HAVE to part with anyone....especially the youngsters who, might I remind everyone, have only just got into the first XI.

Let's be honest mate, none of us on here know if we do or don't have to sell players. It's all pure speculation. The OP has obviously looked at the annual accounts and has made some well thought out assumptions. But let's not ignore the fact that they are assumptions. For starters, we as fans are only privy to financial information that is a year old. Secondly, we have no idea what discussions are going on between the club and the FA with regards to FFP.

I will add that I'm glad it's this way. If detailed and recent financial information was public, and we were under pressure to reduce overheads to satisfy FFP, then the vultures would be circling around our best players.

I personally suspect that there may be a departure or 2 required, firstly to trim the wage bill and secondly for a cash injection to allow us to redress some of the imbalances in the squad (lack of centre forwards etc.). I doubt it will be Smyth or Eze that will go (although if someone came in with stupid money, I suspect both would have their price). But I could see someone like Smithies, Freeman or Luongo going. I also think we'll be trying hard to shift some of the more expensive fringe players like Sylla, Cousins etc.

My biggest concern this summer is the fact that Perch, Ned and Robinson are all out of contract. Of course losing Robinson will be a blow. But let's face it, going into the last year of his contract all of us on here thought he was a write off, he'd barely kicked a ball. Obviously from there he's found some terrific form this season, it's just unfortunate that it's happened in the final year of a 4 year contract. Ned has been a great servant, and we are a far better side when he plays, but he is also hugely overpaid and has been since the day we signed him. Perch I'd let go anyway, always injured and his form has swayed from awesome to downright awful over the course of his contract. Each of these departures in isolation wouldn't be a train smash, but I worry about 3 first team defenders leaving at the same time with very little in the coffers to replace them with.