The LCB issue

[fisnik]

I've been thinking about the Left Centre Back conundrum that we have at the moment. I think the general agreement is that ideally whoever plays there needs to be naturally left footed and it can be quite a specialised role since they are quite liable to be pulled down the wing if the Left Wingback hasn't tracked back for cover.

Now Harry chose to play Dunne there, who fair enough done a decent enough job I thought. But I think everyone thinks that maybe Onuoha needs to be given the nod over him as he is faster and younger, etc. It has made me think though that if you're playing Dunne there why not go for Hill instead who is left footed and perhaps better suited to that position. I mean Hill has got plenty of experience as both an CB and LB which would make him ideal.

[QPR Richard]

If Ned isn't played there, then it should be Clint for the reasons you describe.

[Gerryhatrick]

The job of a centre back is to defend, right or left footed makes little difference if you have experience and read the game well. Dunne is a better defender than Clint. He was mom in the playoff final, and until he lets us down with poor form he deserves his place IMO. Agreed, he's not the quickest, but Caulker is there to cover. Dunne is immense in the air (remember, it was Rio who got mugged in the air last game, maybe he should be dropped?), and his commitment to the cause is unquestionable.

The reason he looked uncomfortable in possession on the left side last game was due to lack of options available for passes, and whether left or right footed, makes no difference. At least he doesn't hoof it. Quality defender the landlord is, respect. Onuoha makes too many errors at this stage of his career, but he is improving and his time will come later.

[fisnik]

The job of a centre back is to defend, right or left footed makes little difference if you have experience and read the game well. Dunne is a better defender than Clint. He was mom in the playoff final, and until he lets us down with poor form he deserves his place IMO. Agreed, he's not the quickest, but Caulker is there to cover. Dunne is immense in the air (remember, it was Rio who got mugged in the air last game, maybe he should be dropped?), and his commitment to the cause is unquestionable.

The reason he looked uncomfortable in possession on the left side last game was due to lack of options available for passes, and whether left or right footed, makes no difference. At least he doesn't hoof it. Quality defender the landlord is, respect. Onuoha makes too many errors at this stage of his career, but he is improving and his time will come later.

I like Dunne a lot and I think we're probably ok with him there a lot of the time. But it is a recognised weakness that playing a right footed player at the left of the back three isn't ideal. I think Man U has the same problem and they were saying on the radio that Van Gaal wants to get a left footed centre half specifically for that position. Saying that we don't have the luxury of throwing money at an issue such as that, so I guess we can make do. But I do think that Hill might be better suited to it than Dunne.

[Grifter]

The job of a centre back is to defend, right or left footed makes little difference if you have experience and read the game well. Dunne is a better defender than Clint. He was mom in the playoff final, and until he lets us down with poor form he deserves his place IMO. Agreed, he's not the quickest, but Caulker is there to cover. Dunne is immense in the air (remember, it was Rio who got mugged in the air last game, maybe he should be dropped?), and his commitment to the cause is unquestionable.

The reason he looked uncomfortable in possession on the left side last game was due to lack of options available for passes, and whether left or right footed, makes no difference. At least he doesn't hoof it. Quality defender the landlord is, respect. Onuoha makes too many errors at this stage of his career, but he is improving and his time will come later.

You think Onouha made more errors than Dunne last season? Other than the sloppy pass to O'niel in the playoff final, I can't think of any

[Gerryhatrick]

I like Dunne a lot and I think we're probably ok with him there a lot of the time. But it is a recognised weakness that playing a right footed player at the left of the back three isn't ideal. I think Man U has the same problem and they were saying on the radio that Van Gaal wants to get a left footed centre half specifically for that position. Saying that we don't have the luxury of throwing money at an issue such as that, so I guess we can make do. But I do think that Hill might be better suited to it than Dunne.

Good to get a debate with reasoning, rather then the usual superior self righteous name calling that often occurs on the site.
It would be interesting to dissect and understand why Hill might be better than Dunne or indeed Ned. A centre backs skills include:-
Man to Man Marking/positioning
Aerial ability/heading
Tackling.
Pace.
On the ball Distribution.
Now I can understand why a left footed CB might be slightly better with distribution, and also maybe tackling on the left side with a left foot lead, but the other areas it makes no difference at all as I can see. Hill comes 2nd to Dunne on aerial ability and pace, they're maybe equal marking due so similar experience, they both read the game well, tackling I reckon Dunne is better and Hill is often close to being red carded. So that leaves distribution, and we assume that a left footed is better on the left side, but I still maintain that it's a question of available options in front of them.

[Gerryhatrick]

You think Onouha made more errors than Dunne last season? Other than the sloppy pass to O'niel in the playoff final, I can't think of any

Don't recall many Ned errors, so maybe my comment was a bit unfair, but he doesnt look comfortable in possession, and seems almost panicky sometimes. His distribution isn't great either, often just pumps the ball up to the front man rather than looking for the short option.

[fisnik]

It is strange with Ned yes. He does look like he panics a bit on the ball but sometimes also seen him make runs forward or try to be a bit cute with it and ends up giving it away.

The Dunne and Hill thing you're probably right, Dunne probably better with the tackles as Hill does make quite a few last ditch tackles/blocks from what I recall (Maybe just the way he plays). With pace I couldn't say, not sure whether it's his size that deceives but Dunne just looks slow. Anyway there probably ain't much in it at all. I'm glad we got both of them in the squad, they're both going to end up playing more games than we think as there's bound to be injuries/suspensions and what not.

[californiahoop]

Great points one and all, and I must admit this debate has made me think. I watched fantasy football lastnight and Trevor Sinclair said the two cb's he liked where Rio and Dunne, he was talking 10+ years ago but class is permanent.

I am/was in the Ned camp but I am now not sure based on the points raised above, I guess we are going to see how things pan out over the next few games.

One interesting stat from the Hull game was the fact that Hull had one shot on target is telling. I was hoping Ehmer would make it but not so sure now. I would like us to buy a young LCB as a long term replacement, our young CB's will have no better teachers than Rio, Dunne, Hill and Ned.

[hal9thou]

Ned just needs a little more composure. No one can seriously be suggesting a back 3 which has Rio plus either Clint or RD - unless forced to by circs. We'd end up too deep. That's what defenders do when there's no pace left.

[fisnik]

Well we did have that against Hull and I think it will happen maybe quite a few times again probably forced by circumstances but who knows. We just don't know whether Harry fancies Ned as a first choice.

[1QPRDK]

If Squawka.com stats are anything to go by Clint wins easily: Clint 1019, Landlord 613, Chief 578 are their performance scores there from last season:

http://www.squawka.com/football-player-rankings#performance-score#player-stats#football-league-championship**season-2013/2014#qpr#defender#16#37#0#0#90#03/08/2013#24/05/2014#season#2#all-matches#total#desc#p666-clint-hill#p255-richard-dunne#p683-onuoha#total Link fixed :-)

[Gerryhatrick]

If Squawka.com stats are anything to go by Clint wins easily: Clint 1019, Landlord 613, Chief 578 are their performance scores there from last season:

http://www.squawka.com/football-player-rankings#performance-score#player-stats#football-league-championship**season-2013/2014#qpr#defender#16#37#0#0#90#03/08/2013#24/05/2014#season#2#all-matches#total#desc#p666-clint-hill#p255-richard-dunne#p683-onuoha#total Link fixed :-)

That's quite a shock. I would have had Hill as 3rd out of the 3. Big surprise if the figures are true.

[zeberdee]

Ned just needs a little more composure. No one can seriously be suggesting a back 3 which has Rio plus either Clint or RD - unless forced to by circs. We'd end up too deep. That's what defenders do when there's no pace left.

Every line up and system has weaknesses - Ned is good but for example wanders up the pitch and at time gets caught in posession - Dunne is slower but was MOTM at wembley and a mainstay of an excellent defence last season

[1QPRDK]

That's quite a shock. I would have had Hill as 3rd out of the 3. Big surprise if the figures are true.

Think the stats reflect the truth pretty well from games I saw last season, their stats has him as best player at our club, and I agree. Not so sure he can do the same job in the Pl, but I am certain he would be a better option than Dunne as LCB in the 352.