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Thread: bitcoin price rising - alternatives for portfolio - tips for next big price rise

  1. #106

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    It's close to 12.5k today. Not sure what the top of this peak is, hold on to your hats. All those of you who bought when I started this thread must be feeling a bit happy...


  2. #107

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    Originally Posted by Hubble
    It's close to 12.5k today. Not sure what the top of this peak is, hold on to your hats. All those of you who bought when I started this thread must be feeling a bit happy...

    Fair play Hubs, your predictions have been near enough spot on.
    I invested a bit last week but obviously should have done a lot sooner.
    Hopefully it’s a case of better late than never !
    He'll regret it till his dying day, if ever he lives that long

  3. #108
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  4. #109

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    Originally Posted by Hubble
    Not sure what the top of this peak is
    As mentioned 3 weeks ago, this latest parabolic bull run is mainly down to this:

    Originally Posted by Stanley
    Wall Street is coming in too now with Bitcoin having the CME futures launch for trading by December - meaning a large influx of money for Bitcoin.

    You can start hearing the footsteps of the herd now...
    Suspect there'll be some kind of correction around Xmas / January time.

    Originally Posted by MYU
    I missed the boat.
    That's a myth mate. No one has missed the boat. It's still relatively early days in the crypto space. Adoption is happening but still very gradually, as it should be. So people getting into crypto now can still make unquantifiable long-term gains. Another huge misconception is that people still don't realise you can buy fractions of a bitcoin. You can invest as little as 10, 20, 50, 100 or whatever you can afford basically.

  5. #110

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    Bought 20 quids worth in 2014 (Bitcoin was worth 400 then) to see what happens. It's stored on an old hard drive that died. Anyone have any tips on extracting or locating files from dead hard drives?

  6. Default

    Originally Posted by Hubble
    Today's bitcoin price: 600

    That's another huge rise since I posted in June and that's more than DOUBLE what it was in March when I started this thread. I just hope some of you got into bitcoin when I suggested.

    I hope you also took note of this, which is a standard view I've learnt amongst those who don't seem to understand bitcoin:



    I hope no one took his advice!!

    As I've said before, in my opinion, the long-term view for bitcoin is that it can only become more valuable as fiat currencies are so vulnerable. And given that the majority of national currencies are fiat - i.e. not based on something like gold, but purely on the government's ability to back it - which in reality means its ability to raise what it owes from taxation - that's a hell of a lot of vulnerability out there.

    Added to that, the financial markets are set to be even rockier as various shocks and major transitions take place, such as Brexit and the election of Donald Trump - plus the high likelihood of massive default by one or more Western economies... the amount of Western (particularly US) debt for example is eye-watering.

    So even at 600 I'd say bitcoin represents a very decent hedge. Of course, I have to add the caveat that nothing is guaranteed - and the price can of course go down as well as up, but the overall trend since its inception for is amazing, if you think that in early 2009 you could get it for less than 1 a coin. And the previous year, for a few pence. From 1 to 600 in seven years - who can name a better investment than that?
    Don't know too much about this but a guy at work has bought hardware and software and is going to start 'mining' bitcoins. He's setting it up abroad where the electricity prices are cheaper. If you understand what he's doing, can you please explain in very basic layman's terms?

  7. #112

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    Originally Posted by UpperP
    Don't know too much about this but a guy at work has bought hardware and software and is going to start 'mining' bitcoins. He's setting it up abroad where the electricity prices are cheaper. If you understand what he's doing, can you please explain in very basic layman's terms?
    It's complicated. It takes a lot of hardware, time and above all, electricity.

    Decent straightforward summary here: https://www.bitcoinmining.com

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    Ether anyone?

    Now might be a good time to transfer a btc margin into ether.......

    One problem: the crypto exchanges, their transaction mark ups are steep. Local Bitcoins still best value?

    Originally Posted by Kirill
    That price hike looks to me like the last hurrah due to some inherent programming limitations that the parties are now divided on the ways to overcome. I'd sell right now and get the hell out of Dodge.
    A lot has changed since then......

    I wonder if some people are (literally) banking on the fact that btc supply is theoretically finite.....
    Last edited by hal9thou; 08-12-2017 at 01:54 AM.

  9. #114

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    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    Ether anyone?

    Now might be a good time to transfer a btc margin into ether.......
    Ether's an excellent long-term bet. It's still under-valued but it has many technical issues still to resolve which are slowly being worked on. IOTA, Monero, Omisego, Neo, Litecoin are some other strong alt currencies with good technology and sound development teams behind them. 2018 is predicted to be a big year for all of these coins. It's already started with IOTA and Monero.

    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    One problem: the crypto exchanges, their transaction mark ups are steep. Local Bitcoins still best value?
    You can eliminate fees by linking your Coinbase account to GDAX, which is an exchange Coinbase owns. It's a fairly straightforward process, there's some YT tutorials on how to do it.

    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    I wonder if some people are (literally) banking on the fact that btc supply is theoretically finite.....
    It's calculated at around the year 2140 before the last bitcoin is mined. Bitcoin is similar to Gold as that also has a finite supply and can also be subdivided into tiny fractions, the smallest being a satoshi which is one hundred millionth of a single bitcoin (0.00000001 BTC). How its value will be affected once they're all mined is anyone's guess, but it seems likely that a limited supply of the currency may cause prices to continue to increase. There are also stockpiles of inactive coins held around the world, the largest supply belongs to the person or group who founded Bitcoin, Satoshi Nakamoto. Perhaps this supply, consisting of about a million Bitcoins, is intentionally being saved for a time when the global supply is facing increased levels of demand.

  10. #115
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    Originally Posted by Stanley
    Ether's an excellent long-term bet. It's still under-valued but it has many technical issues still to resolve which are slowly being worked on. IOTA, Monero, Omisego, Neo, Litecoin are some other strong alt currencies with good technology and sound development teams behind them. 2018 is predicted to be a big year for all of these coins. It's already started with IOTA and Monero.
    Have any of you invested in any of these yet?
    "When you look annoyed all the time, people think you're busy"

  11. Default

    Originally Posted by Brian Wilson
    Have any of you invested in any of these yet?
    Tried doing a BTC / Ether transaction via blockchain.info Right idea, wrong broker - traffic delays etc. Cryptocurrency exchanges still have a slightly wild west vibe, unexplained delay, huge margin variance, the odd 67m btc disappearing.... you know, stuff. My advice FWIW would be to buy your own hardware wallet.....

    Ether looks to me an excellent bet becuase it integrates smoothly with application development, meaning it can function as a flexible platform. (I think I've got that right, please feel free to correct.) And that is interesting to banks and developers. Russia is said to be 'supportive' of Ether and Putin has publically endorsed it. All of which may mean its a very decent long term bet. Your call.....

  12. #117

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    Originally Posted by Brian Wilson
    Have any of you invested in any of these yet?
    Yes I have. I'd still recommend beginning with Bitcoin though, then diversifying into these other strong alts as and when you're ready, especially if you're in it as a long-term investor as opposed to trading. The main rule of thumb is to buy on the dips (and sell on the highs if choosing to skim occasional profits). The bulk of one's portfolio should be BTC though IMO.

    Disclaimer: None of my posts on this thread should be taken as financial advice. It's just a layman's view of the markets from having observed them over the past couple of years. Always do your own research. I can recommend a couple of good YouTube channels to subscribe to, if interested.

  13. #118

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    ...just to add, compared to FIAT, cryptos remain very volatile - a bit like a rubber dinghy trying to negotiate rough choppy waters by comparison to a cruise liner i.e. very up and down. But the overall trend since 2009 (when btc first appeared) is an exponential upward curve for the strong ones.

  14. #119

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    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    Tried doing a BTC / Ether transaction via blockchain.info Right idea, wrong broker - traffic delays etc. Cryptocurrency exchanges still have a slightly wild west vibe, unexplained delay, huge margin variance, the odd 67m btc disappearing.... you know, stuff.
    Never traded on that site. The exchanges I'd recommend are Bitfinex, Bittrex or Poloniex, probably in that order. GDAX too if you can link your Coinbase account to it (no fess that way). Shapeshift is very handy too for quick exchanging of one crytpo to another.

    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    My advice FWIW would be to buy your own hardware wallet.....
    This is probably the most important advice for keeping your funds secure. Ledger Nano S and Trezor do the best hardware wallets. Exodus is one of the safest online wallets as it has lots of security measures. Online wallets are fine for smaller amounts. Never store funds on exchanges though - too risky to hacks, companies going out of business etc...

    Originally Posted by hal9thou
    Russia is said to be 'supportive' of Ether and Putin has publically endorsed it. All of which may mean its a very decent long term bet. Your call.....
    True but his endorsement might have something to do with Ether's founder Vitalik Buterin being Russian ;-) I've heard he's pretty hardline on cryptos in general as he wants nothing to challenge his precious Rouble too much.

  15. #120

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    Wow, this thread has kicked into life!! Well, well, well, welcome aboard the crypto train fellow Rangers!

    Okay, just to add a bit to what Stan has admirably explained:

    Ethereum: I agree, this is an excellent long-term bet. Its underlying tech looks sound to me, and given that that is its raison d'etre, and so many other things can run on it, I predict a big future. I diversified some btc into Eth some time ago (look at the title of this thread and my first post), and it looks like that was a good decision, as Eth has done really well since then. I used Poloniex as the exchange for this - and I know Stan has too. I've found Poloniex to be straightforward and easy to use.

    So far I've used localbitcoins.com to sell. Sadly, I've had to sell most of my btc holding to live off, but now it's doing so well I can sell a fraction, instead of the early days when, horror of horrors, I sold a few btc for around 300/400! I diversified into a modest portfolio as well, using the Exodus.io wallet for some of that. Because I was already holding btc, and eth, I benefitted from both of the first forks and got my equivalent in bitcoin cash and eth classic. So I currently have some eth, eth classic, bch, Dash (which I think is another very sound long term bet), BAT coin, which is still a low-cost altcoin but I think it has a potentially bright future, and of course my remaining btc. I agree with Stan that Monero looks very good too and that's the next thing I'm going into. Bottom line there are 100s of altcoins out there and you have to really do your research to try and get in on the the ground floor of some of these. I'm lucky that I have a very good friend who's an expert and advises me on what to look out for.

    The state of play: You're right Hal - it is the Wild West out there in crypto land, so the watchword has to be caveat emptor. A case in point was what happened this week when I was selling a bit during the frenzied price rise and someone tried to scam me into sending him some btc without him paying first. Basically when you do a trade on an exchange the bitcoin goes into escrow until the buyer's money reaches the seller's bank account ( you can do it cash in hand or by other methods if you wish). This guy sent me a screenshot of his bank page with it showing he'd made a payment into my a/c and asked me to pay up, all very friendly. It looked 100% legit, but (wisely as it proved), I waited to see the actual money in my account. It never showed up. To begin with I thought it was just a slow transfer and he even told me he'd called his bank and they told him the transfer had gone through. In the end I waited 24 hours (that being about the longest it should ever take for a direct transfer), then I put the trade into dispute. It took another 2 days to get the btc credited back to my wallet, but I did get it all back. Later I read on the exchange forum that other folk hadn't been so careful and had been duped into giving their btc to this scammer. So there's a salutary tale for you.

    Uppers - you asked about bitcoin mining. To be honest, I'd be amazed if your colleague could make any money from it unless he had a huge amount to invest in the hardware and he really knows his stuff. If he's doing it in China, and is part of a consortium, then he maybe could be on to a good thing. Bitcoin 'mining' is basically getting a CPU to do the insanely complex calculations it requires to produce one bitcoin. This gets exponentially harder the more coins are produced, which is one of the built-in safeguards into how bitcoin works. When I first got into bitcoin, there were so few people using it, you could mine a bitcoin using your computer's GPU, and I actually used mine to mine half a bitcoin! That would be utterly impossible these days. In fact it was so rare and unknown in those days that there were sites like the bitcoin well where you could get a bitcoin just for giving them your email address. By the time I used the 'well' it was still dispensing half a btc, which I have managed to lose somewhere on my PC. Which leads me to your question Hovis, about recovering data from a hard disk. Yes, that is totally possible, Google it for more info.


    These days the bulk of bitcoin mining is done in China, where electricity is dirt cheap, and often they set up mining rigs right next to wind or solar farms or hydro-electric generators, because it uses a vast amount of power. Other places where they're taking advantage of cheap power and subsidies are Russia and Iceland. Some people are now slating crypto mining because of the huge amount of power it sucks up, but the irony is that the mining is driving a green power revolution, because renewables are the best way forward. And what people forget to factor in is how much it costs to sustain the petrodollar and fiat currencies. In reality, it costs untold billions and millions of lives to keep that unholy system going.

    Hal: delays: yes my friend - with the whole world and his wife jumping into crypto, exchanges and the blockchain can get clogged up. That's one of the big issues that the 'hard forks' are attempting to resolve. I once waited 24 hours for a bitcoin transfer to take place, but generally I've never waited longer than an hour. My eth and other altcoin transfers are usually really quick. That, I'm afraid, is the nature of the beast. But usually you have an option to pay a bit more for a faster transfer.

    As for wallets; well, I still think the good old blockchain.info one is solid as ever, I've had mine for 7 years now. The worst place to store your crypto is on an exchange, because they are the most vulnerable to attack, as we have seen several times of the last few years, starting with the infamous Mt.gox attack (which some are saying was an inside job). So I'd suggest only having money in an exchange wallet if you are trading, otherwise use something like the blockchain one, or Exodus, or take your pick. The problem I have with hard wallets - where you store your crypto on a memory stick - is that I'd be too afraid of losing it! Each to his own, as they say.

    Longterm for bitcoin? Like I've always said, I think it's the new gold, and as a store of value, I can only see its price going up and up. Stan, you've rightly mentioned the CME futures launch, which could see another huge spike in bitcoin. That might be a good time to divest a little, but even though it's likely to get super volatile around then, I'd still say hold on to your hats, because as a store of value, bitcoin is the crpyto gold standard.

    The really interesting thing to see is how much the big banks and financial institutions are starting to freak out about bitcoin now. Clearly a sign the tide is turning!
    Last edited by Hubble; 08-12-2017 at 06:39 PM.

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