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  • #31
    Originally posted by 3London View Post
    Mathematically we can still go down but we won't but we may finish 4th from bottom! the club as a whole relaxed too soon. the experimenting process started way way to early.
    I agree ,think we will JUST stay up,when we were in a position to finish top half but too many players felt the job was already done and certainly against Bristol too many players wore their flip flops

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Rebel R's View Post
      I agree ,think we will JUST stay up,when we were in a position to finish top half but too many players felt the job was already done and certainly against Bristol too many players wore their flip flops
      should've put forward the form team and tactics for Derby/Villa. Those two will be pushing promotion next season would've been good to know where we stood.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by stanistheman View Post
        So you believe this is all Holloway' s pre season preparations ?
        In the main, yes, whilst obviously trying his best to win games in the process, for team morale.

        Originally posted by stanistheman View Post
        I think it is more of his tinkering not knowing what is his best team tactics or formation nonsense.
        It's not a huge priority for him to know his best team yet.

        Originally posted by stanistheman View Post
        The chances are there will be a few more players joining or leaving in the summer which will again see more tinkering during the autumn fixtures.
        Suspect this summer is more about which players we can shift and get off the books, than who to bring in. Of course we need 2 or 3 additions but more need to go and this is the first time in many years we've been in that situation, which is definitely a positive.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Stanley View Post
          In the main, yes, whilst obviously trying his best to win games in the process for team morale.



          It's not a huge priority for him to know his best team yet.



          Suspect this summer is more about which players we can shift and get off the books, than who to bring in. Of course we need 2 or 3 additions but more need to go and this is the first time in many years we've been in that situation, which is definitely a positive.
          All the above.

          Though, lose all out last 4 and perform the same as we did against Bristol and i'll be concerned for our pre-season.

          Right now things are much better than they seem. Even if this is all Ollie can do for us, it's alot more than we've had for the last few years.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Rebel R's View Post
            I agree ,think we will JUST stay up
            Bang on. Personally can see us finishing 1 or 2 points above 3rd from bottom

            Comment


            • #36
              Forget all these experimenting excuses - what you are seeing is what many of us had concerns about when he was appointed: tactical ineptness.

              The evidence is right in front of anyone who cares to look. So even when he has a decent set up on the park the basics are awful. No triangles, poor movement off the ball, players too far away from each other, too isolated. That's when things are good. When they are bad (three at the back) you have chronic lack of width at both ends, no attempt to remedy this despite mounting eveidence that we just don't have the players to make it work. That's not experimenting. That's just awful game management. You'll always scramble a few points under Olly but the Fernandes disaster movie is long running.

              The meter says >0.25 bn now, for what? For being further down the table than we were when he turned up. What an abortion the whole show has been. Anyone who thinks we're building is deluding themselves. You cant build on sand, there's no quality on the park bar GK and even less off it. If nothing changes there is absolutely no way we are going up next year, that's just dreaming. Harsh but true.
              Last edited by hal9thou; 16-04-2017, 12:16 PM.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by hal9thou View Post
                Forget all these experimenting excuses - what you are seeing is what many of us had concerns about when he was appointed: tactical ineptness.

                The evidence is right in front of anyone who cares to look. So even when he has a decent set up on the park the basics are awful. No triangles, poor movement off the ball, players too far away from each other, too isolated. That's when things are good. When they are bad (three at the back) you have chronic lack of width at both ends, no attempt to remedy this despite mounting eveidence that we just don't have the players to make it work. That's not experimenting. That's just awful game management. You'll always scramble a few points under Olly but the Fernandes disaster movie is long running.

                The meter says >0.25 bn now, for what? For being further down the table than we were when he turned up. What an abortion the whole show has been. Anyone who thinks we're building is deluding themselves. You cant build on sand, there's no quality on the park bar GK and even less off it. If nothing changes there is absolutely no way we are going up next year, that's just dreaming. Harsh but true.
                Absolutely spot on - great post. Sums up the whole situation under The Tinkerman

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by hal9thou View Post
                  Forget all these experimenting excuses - what you are seeing is what many of us had concerns about when he was appointed: tactical ineptness.

                  The evidence is right in front of anyone who cares to look. So even when he has a decent set up on the park the basics are awful. No triangles, poor movement off the ball, players too far away from each other, too isolated. That's when things are good. When they are bad (three at the back) you have chronic lack of width at both ends, no attempt to remedy this despite mounting eveidence that we just don't have the players to make it work. That's not experimenting. That's just awful game management. You'll always scramble a few points under Olly but the Fernandes disaster movie is long running.

                  The meter says >0.25 bn now, for what? For being further down the table than we were when he turned up. What an abortion the whole show has been. Anyone who thinks we're building is deluding themselves. You cant build on sand, there's no quality on the park bar GK and even less off it. If nothing changes there is absolutely no way we are going up next year, that's just dreaming. Harsh but true.
                  I disagree.
                  Happy Easter
                  Minds Are Like Parachutes.
                  Work Best When Open...
                  @Nowt2SeeHere

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by bigray View Post
                    Absolutely spot on - great post. Sums up the whole situation under The Tinkerman
                    Same tinkerman that won the premier league nice
                    I played sunday league football today.

                    Clearly I was the best player on the pitch.

                    I scored 5 and made 7 last ditch tackles.

                    We lost 5-0 but the rest of my team were sh it!

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by hal9thou View Post
                      Forget all these experimenting excuses - what you are seeing is what many of us had concerns about when he was appointed: tactical ineptness.

                      The evidence is right in front of anyone who cares to look. So even when he has a decent set up on the park the basics are awful. No triangles, poor movement off the ball, players too far away from each other, too isolated. That's when things are good. When they are bad (three at the back) you have chronic lack of width at both ends, no attempt to remedy this despite mounting eveidence that we just don't have the players to make it work. That's not experimenting. That's just awful game management. You'll always scramble a few points under Olly but the Fernandes disaster movie is long running.

                      The meter says >0.25 bn now, for what? For being further down the table than we were when he turned up. What an abortion the whole show has been. Anyone who thinks we're building is deluding themselves. You cant build on sand, there's no quality on the park bar GK and even less off it. If nothing changes there is absolutely no way we are going up next year, that's just dreaming. Harsh but true.
                      Hal mate book a holiday away treat the misses you really need a break
                      I played sunday league football today.

                      Clearly I was the best player on the pitch.

                      I scored 5 and made 7 last ditch tackles.

                      We lost 5-0 but the rest of my team were sh it!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        We're doomed!
                        @gatorTFC

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by hal9thou View Post
                          Forget all these experimenting excuses - what you are seeing is what many of us had concerns about when he was appointed: tactical ineptness.

                          The evidence is right in front of anyone who cares to look. So even when he has a decent set up on the park the basics are awful. No triangles, poor movement off the ball, players too far away from each other, too isolated. That's when things are good. When they are bad (three at the back) you have chronic lack of width at both ends, no attempt to remedy this despite mounting eveidence that we just don't have the players to make it work. That's not experimenting. That's just awful game management. You'll always scramble a few points under Olly but the Fernandes disaster movie is long running.

                          The meter says >0.25 bn now, for what? For being further down the table than we were when he turned up. What an abortion the whole show has been. Anyone who thinks we're building is deluding themselves. You cant build on sand, there's no quality on the park bar GK and even less off it. If nothing changes there is absolutely no way we are going up next year, that's just dreaming. Harsh but true.
                          Who would you want as our next manager Hal ?
                          He'll regret it till his dying day, if ever he lives that long

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by gator View Post
                            We're doomed!
                            more like resigned.....

                            Originally posted by Itsonlyagame View Post
                            Who would you want as our next manager Hal ?
                            At different times under TF - and in no particular order - Rodgers, Silva, Martinez, Flores, Bilic, Villas Boas, Clement and Montella have all been available and suggested here as realistic targets: eg when Ramsey was appointed we were still EPL with a chance of staying up (even though Harry was allowed to fester and should have gone much sooner). Swansea are struggling right now but for me they still look more organised under Clement than they were before. Slaven has struggled too but like us WHU have boardroom issues and the move from Upton Park was always going to be tough. The fact is we are unable to make quality management choices. It used to be simple incompetence, but now the reactionary fiscal policy in situ means that no credible candidate would come here: peanuts / monkey syndrome. And then of course we're embedded with dear old Les, not a selling point when it comes to attracting decent management. Halfassed nonsense like JFH and Ollie just illustrate the point.

                            If I'd chucked over a quarter of a billion down the khazi but wanted to retain an interest the one thing I would do is employ someone credible to run the show, and give him the option re Les. For me Ramsey, JFH and Ollie lack credibility for different reasons. Put it this way - if we really had approached quality managers and been turned down, we should have asked ourselves a long while ago why they weren't interested, sorted that out and made another serious approach to the same calibre of manager.

                            All the ones on my list are now in work and doing well, although like I say its been difficult for Bilic and PC. But every single one of them would imo have been preferable to at least our last three appointments. We're stuck with Ollie for better or worse, and given that and the quality of playing staff mid table is respectable. But for the money spent it should have been so much better.
                            Last edited by hal9thou; 16-04-2017, 07:48 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by gator View Post
                              We're doomed!
                              I don't think so,think we will stay up by reaching 52 points

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by hal9thou View Post
                                At different times under TF - and in no particular order - Rodgers, Silva, Martinez, Flores, Bilic, Villas Boas, Clement and Montella have all been available and suggested here as realistic targets: eg when Ramsey was appointed we were still EPL with a chance of staying up (even though Harry was allowed to fester and should have gone much sooner). Swansea are struggling right now but for me they still look more organised under Clement than they were before. Slaven has struggled too but like us WHU have boardroom issues and the move from Upton Park was always going to be tough. The fact is we are unable to make quality management choices. It used to be simple incompetence, but now the reactionary fiscal policy in situ means that no credible candidate would come here: peanuts / monkey syndrome. And then of course we're embedded with dear old Les, not a selling point when it comes to attracting decent management. Halfassed nonsense like JFH and Ollie just illustrate the point.

                                If I'd chucked over a quarter of a billion down the khazi but wanted to retain an interest the one thing I would do is employ someone credible to run the show, and give him the option re Les. For me Ramsey, JFH and Ollie lack credibility for different reasons. Put it this way - if we really had approached quality managers and been turned down, we should have asked ourselves a long while ago why they weren't interested, sorted that out and made another serious approach to the same calibre of manager.

                                All the ones on my list are now in work and doing well, although like I say its been difficult for Bilic and PC. But every single one of them would imo have been preferable to at least our last three appointments. We're stuck with Ollie for better or worse, and given that and the quality of playing staff mid table is respectable. But for the money spent it should have been so much better.
                                Pessimistic as usual Hal but at least you always present well-reasoned arguments

                                Originally posted by gator View Post
                                We're doomed!
                                Originally posted by Rebel R's View Post
                                I don't think so,think we will stay up by reaching 52 points
                                He was being sarcastic Rebel :-)

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